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	<title>Comments on: Swine Flu: Fact Versus Fantasy</title>
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	<link>http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/07/swine-flu-fact-versus-fantasy/</link>
	<description>A Voice for Tikkun Olam (healing the world)</description>
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		<title>By: Olystuart</title>
		<link>http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/07/swine-flu-fact-versus-fantasy/comment-page-1/#comment-2503</link>
		<dc:creator>Olystuart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 20:55:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/?p=6665#comment-2503</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve read a good deal on this issue since I work with children, and my first reaction to it all is still my main feeling now:  that focusing on the vaccine is missing the opportunity to make effective choices on the issue.  The number of deaths from swine flu is just so low compared to what&#039;s going on in the world right now, with things like climate chaos, countries going under water, looming mass migrations, global military empire, fascist corporate death-panels (to steal a phrase and use it more accurately), I mean we&#039;re still clearcutting the Rain Forests!  And people are worrying about a flu?  Look, there&#039;s nothing wrong with hearing about a big flu season coming up and reading about it, preparing, deciding what you want to do - great, but then move on, because in the bigger picture swine flu is a tiny tiny blip on the radar.  The only way we could take this swine flu thing and make a real change towards preventing the sort of thing in the future is by launching a massive campaign to make intensive/corporate/factory farming obsolete, completely reforming our agricultural systems by revitalizing local food infrastructures, etc., look at the kinds of things that are destroying American immune systems and start eliminating those, make a huge leap forward for our response to climate change overnight (warmer climate means big outbreaks of infectious disease), things like that.  Basically, things that aren&#039;t likely to happen because our societal inertia is so stuck on comfort.  -shrug-</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve read a good deal on this issue since I work with children, and my first reaction to it all is still my main feeling now:  that focusing on the vaccine is missing the opportunity to make effective choices on the issue.  The number of deaths from swine flu is just so low compared to what&#8217;s going on in the world right now, with things like climate chaos, countries going under water, looming mass migrations, global military empire, fascist corporate death-panels (to steal a phrase and use it more accurately), I mean we&#8217;re still clearcutting the Rain Forests!  And people are worrying about a flu?  Look, there&#8217;s nothing wrong with hearing about a big flu season coming up and reading about it, preparing, deciding what you want to do &#8211; great, but then move on, because in the bigger picture swine flu is a tiny tiny blip on the radar.  The only way we could take this swine flu thing and make a real change towards preventing the sort of thing in the future is by launching a massive campaign to make intensive/corporate/factory farming obsolete, completely reforming our agricultural systems by revitalizing local food infrastructures, etc., look at the kinds of things that are destroying American immune systems and start eliminating those, make a huge leap forward for our response to climate change overnight (warmer climate means big outbreaks of infectious disease), things like that.  Basically, things that aren&#8217;t likely to happen because our societal inertia is so stuck on comfort.  -shrug-</p>
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		<title>By: JustJack</title>
		<link>http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/07/swine-flu-fact-versus-fantasy/comment-page-1/#comment-2404</link>
		<dc:creator>JustJack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 18:28:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/?p=6665#comment-2404</guid>
		<description>We were going to get the vax (we work with kids) and vax our kids (9 and 12). But then she came home with H1N1 flu, I got it, they got it. We&#039;re done. No need to vax now. While we&#039;ve read about the severity of other cases, we consider ourselves fortunate: aside from the initial fever and the pesky frustrating cough, we got off easy (for a change). From our standpoint the Beijing flu that hammered Los Angeles @1993-1994 was far worse, cost us more in terms of lost wages from having to be home..... and no vax available.

The thing that I feel is better this time round compared to &#039;76 is that we have the internet and I was able to get science based and hard science info on the H1N1 to help inform our decisions. Back then we had media hysteria, rumor and propaganda. Okay, so we still have those today but we have the science right in front of us (or at the public library with internet access).  

I still feel this is far too hysterically hyped, perhaps reflecting of my anti-authoritarian nature. There is entirely NOT enough oversight of big pharma (whose meds I do rely upon) and entirely NOT ENOUGH science and science-intelligence people and media for me to simply &quot;trust&quot; even the CDC on any matter. But I&#039;m not going to sit around and wait on someone to tell me what to do on any matter anyway. I&#039;m going to go find out what I need to know, listen to experts and anecdotes and make an informed decision. My biggest concern is access to enough of the hard data and reliable credible anecdotal info in order to make my decision at all. Without the Internet, no one has that path available. And that to me, is worth a little concern.

This isn&#039;t anything new to us either. we&#039;ve been through the whole hoohah around natural childbirth, home births (we had both), delayed vaxes, thimerasol-free vaxes, breastfeeding, child-rearing, child onset &quot;mental illness&quot;, the gammut. The world is not short on the amount of crazy out there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We were going to get the vax (we work with kids) and vax our kids (9 and 12). But then she came home with H1N1 flu, I got it, they got it. We&#8217;re done. No need to vax now. While we&#8217;ve read about the severity of other cases, we consider ourselves fortunate: aside from the initial fever and the pesky frustrating cough, we got off easy (for a change). From our standpoint the Beijing flu that hammered Los Angeles @1993-1994 was far worse, cost us more in terms of lost wages from having to be home&#8230;.. and no vax available.</p>
<p>The thing that I feel is better this time round compared to &#8217;76 is that we have the internet and I was able to get science based and hard science info on the H1N1 to help inform our decisions. Back then we had media hysteria, rumor and propaganda. Okay, so we still have those today but we have the science right in front of us (or at the public library with internet access).  </p>
<p>I still feel this is far too hysterically hyped, perhaps reflecting of my anti-authoritarian nature. There is entirely NOT enough oversight of big pharma (whose meds I do rely upon) and entirely NOT ENOUGH science and science-intelligence people and media for me to simply &#8220;trust&#8221; even the CDC on any matter. But I&#8217;m not going to sit around and wait on someone to tell me what to do on any matter anyway. I&#8217;m going to go find out what I need to know, listen to experts and anecdotes and make an informed decision. My biggest concern is access to enough of the hard data and reliable credible anecdotal info in order to make my decision at all. Without the Internet, no one has that path available. And that to me, is worth a little concern.</p>
<p>This isn&#8217;t anything new to us either. we&#8217;ve been through the whole hoohah around natural childbirth, home births (we had both), delayed vaxes, thimerasol-free vaxes, breastfeeding, child-rearing, child onset &#8220;mental illness&#8221;, the gammut. The world is not short on the amount of crazy out there.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Marmorek</title>
		<link>http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/07/swine-flu-fact-versus-fantasy/comment-page-1/#comment-2400</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Marmorek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 16:54:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/?p=6665#comment-2400</guid>
		<description>Hi Dave,

Fine post: I was blogging about the swine flu on &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.tikkunista.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Tikkunista&lt;/a&gt;! this week too. The most interesting comments I came across weren&#039;t about the health issue, but rather about the phenomenon of how many people are resisting mainstream medical advice: certainly more than I&#039;ve seen before in Canada. I would guess that&#039;s true for folks elsewhere too.  Here&#039;s &lt;em&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.rabble.ca/news/2009/11/rage-against-vaccine&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Rage Against the Vaccine&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt; from Judy Rebbick&#039;s radical Canadian website  rabble.ca. 
&lt;blockquote&gt;Here&#039;s my theory. Deep down, it&#039;s about a growing collective mistrust in authority as much as it&#039;s about the vaccine. It&#039;s about challenging authority in one of the few ways people have left these days. They are exercising their right to refuse when it comes to their health.
They didn&#039;t have time for a well-orchestrated protest when authorities came for their jobs, their taxes, their homes and so on. Now they are saying NO to that powerful wave of government, media, medical, church and other authority figures who are saying get the shot; it&#039;s good for you.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
And the funniest comment was certainly &lt;a href=&quot;http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2009-10-24/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Dilbert&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Dave,</p>
<p>Fine post: I was blogging about the swine flu on <a href="http://www.tikkunista.com" rel="nofollow">Tikkunista</a>! this week too. The most interesting comments I came across weren&#8217;t about the health issue, but rather about the phenomenon of how many people are resisting mainstream medical advice: certainly more than I&#8217;ve seen before in Canada. I would guess that&#8217;s true for folks elsewhere too.  Here&#8217;s <em><a href="http://www.rabble.ca/news/2009/11/rage-against-vaccine" rel="nofollow"><em>Rage Against the Vaccine</em></a></em> from Judy Rebbick&#8217;s radical Canadian website  rabble.ca. </p>
<blockquote><p>Here&#8217;s my theory. Deep down, it&#8217;s about a growing collective mistrust in authority as much as it&#8217;s about the vaccine. It&#8217;s about challenging authority in one of the few ways people have left these days. They are exercising their right to refuse when it comes to their health.<br />
They didn&#8217;t have time for a well-orchestrated protest when authorities came for their jobs, their taxes, their homes and so on. Now they are saying NO to that powerful wave of government, media, medical, church and other authority figures who are saying get the shot; it&#8217;s good for you.</p></blockquote>
<p>And the funniest comment was certainly <a href="http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2009-10-24/" rel="nofollow">Dilbert</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Lauren Reichelt</title>
		<link>http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/07/swine-flu-fact-versus-fantasy/comment-page-1/#comment-2397</link>
		<dc:creator>Lauren Reichelt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 06:16:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/?p=6665#comment-2397</guid>
		<description>Thank you for providing information to the public.  This particular flu spreads extremely rapidly and it seems to me that an alarming number of healthy young people have died this fall in my state. I would certainly vaccinate my own children if that option were available to me. 

Vaccines pose risks, but the risk of epidemics such as cholera, smallpox and diptheria are far greater. 

Flu evolves rapidly.  A highly contagious flu has an even greater chance of mutating. Vigilance is wise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for providing information to the public.  This particular flu spreads extremely rapidly and it seems to me that an alarming number of healthy young people have died this fall in my state. I would certainly vaccinate my own children if that option were available to me. </p>
<p>Vaccines pose risks, but the risk of epidemics such as cholera, smallpox and diptheria are far greater. </p>
<p>Flu evolves rapidly.  A highly contagious flu has an even greater chance of mutating. Vigilance is wise.</p>
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